Re: What religion are you?
 

So then your implying that Jesus wont let us into heaven if we dont believ in him? Now, do you mean believe in him in the sense as the son of God, or as a person. Because Muslims believe Jesus was real....he just wasn't the son of God.

That would be a pretty doucheriffic thing to do.

Now, why would Jesus, a person who loves all man and died for our sins, not want us to be saved eternally and go to heaven for having our own piece of mind? Im sure Jeus would condone that. Im sure Jesus would condone not being a sheep and following the herd.


But as the cake song says : "Sheep go to heaven, Goats go to hell."

Figure the meaning out for yourselves.

Re: What religion are you?
 

Harrassing people with religious beliefs is just something weak people need to do to make them feel better about the fact that they don't believe in anything beyond that which is blatantly obvious or factual.

My question for you is; why not believe in a God? Why not have hope, or faith in something good?

Re: What religion are you?
 

I believe in a higher power. It just doesn't control me through a book.

Re: What religion are you?
 

You mother ****er. How dare you question my commitment to God and to helping others. If you really want to know, I help out at a local foodbank every weekend that I can get home from university. I will definitely be there this upcoming Thanksgiving weekend. I go to church, I donate to the church, and I donate money to charities that I choose. Do not ever question what I will do when I graduate university. First of all, I want to get into a not for profit business and be there accountant. And if that doesn't work out, who cares? How about I become a the CFO for a huge company? Yeah, how about I make millions of dollars? Yeah, even if I do, I will never forget who I believe in, and I will never stop helping out those who are less fortunate.

You really pissed me off with that comment man.

Well first of all, a Christian is one who believe that Jesus is the Son of God.

Second of all, nobody on Earth is perfect. There are many Christians who do great things in the name of God. There are many Christians who sin.

But you know what? If these people realize that they sinned, and tell that to God, they will go to heaven. Therefore, they are still Christians.

Re: What religion are you?
 

I aplologize, it was wrong of me to attack what I didn't know, I should have phrased my point differently. What I'm trying to say is, fundamentally, you're supposed to do EVERYTHING you can to help others. Not just what's comfortable. And Christianity is supposed to be about following every teaching or doing of Jesus. I know some self-professed "Christians" who do nothing of the sort. It's kind of like they use it as a veil to cover up their mistakes. Sin all during the week, go to church, get your slice of Christ, be set for another week. That kind of belief is what pisses me off.

Re: What religion are you?
 

Thanks for the apology man. I was super pissed at what you said, haha.

Anyways, I am not sure if my priest made this up or not, but one time he said:

"John didn't go to hell for what he did on Sunday. He went to hell for what he did on Monday."

Re: What religion are you?
 

Lets go back to 3 people. I shall name them.

1. Mother Theresa.(sp?)
2. Jesus Christ.
3. Pope John Paul(sp?) (whichever one it is now)


There are probably more, but meh.

What horrific unperfect things have these people done? :p

Re: What religion are you?
 

I meant other than Jesus, lol.

And you can sin in your thoughts too. NOBODY IS PERFECT (except for Jesus).

Re: What religion are you?
 

Ha I like that one.
This is how it goes so often, people go to church on sunday, but forget God the rest of the week.

And I want to explain again that the bible teaches that there are 3 things you have to do to get 'saved': belief, knowledge, actions.

People who only simply believe it, but don't act like it, are wrong. People who live a good life, but refuse to believe in God (when given the chance), are wrong too.

And the Pope isn't free of sin, far from it. :p

Re: What religion are you?
 

dropCGCF, don't think I'm just picking on you here. I've quoted you a couple of times, but by no means am I trying to single you out here. This comment here is made by so many "non-believers". I think I already said this before in this post, but I'm going to say it again.

Religious people aren't weak people. They are trying to juggle two goals in their life. They have a common goal, a goal that is harder to obtain then any non Religious person has. Almost everybody in this world (religious or not) wants to be successful in one way or another. Be it rich with money, family, love, fame, worldly objects, etc... It's what ever their hearts desire. But when you do not believe in god, this is where your goals stop. We believe there is something else out there judging us. So we can't just be single minded think we have achieved everything when we get to our worldly goals. We have come to an understanding that there is more to this life then what is put in front of us. And yes, we want to spend eternity happy. Who doesn't? Doesn't matter what you think eternity is (be it an eternal sleep, or reigning with your God).

So here we are, trying to achieve a greater goodness. And people think we are weak? How so, we have to live up to so much more then what man has put before us. Even if we are rich beyond our wildest dreams, that doesn’t mean anything in the afterlife. We still have to live a Christian life to live with God. That is not weak, by any means. It’s actually more stressful because there is more on our plate then with non believers.

Now for people that stick behind that argument that God doesn’t exist because Science doesn’t prove it. What has to be understood is that God created this earth (and universe, solar system, galaxy, etc…) and with this earth certain rules apply. Over the years, man has become smarter and is now able to understand our surroundings. So what we believed that the earth was flat. God never said that in the bible (not trying to hide behind the bible, I just don’t want people saying that some Catholic in some far away time said that is what God told him, all men have flaws). But through science we learned that the earth isn’t flat. Same goes for the earth being the center of the universe. Anything that God does on this earth can be explained through science. Why, because God set these rules and he won’t break them. If he did, he wouldn’t be perfect. So all the miracles that have happened through the times, I believe that science will be able to explain why that happened. As for the big bang theory, that is all it is. Everybody wants FACTS when it comes to religion, but they are willing to take a theory from scientists. The same goes with evolution, just another scientific theory. Remember how we used to believe the Earth was flat? Those where the scholars at the time, telling us it was true. But they were proven wrong. So how can people that only believe in science be so sure that’s how civilization came to be? Through an unproven fact… a theory.

Fact, that seems to be the big word in this discussion. Everybody that doesn’t believe in God or the bible wants facts. That is good; you don’t want to be running after some street preacher because he sounds like he knows what he is talking about. Next thing you know, you will be living through his eyes and giving him all your money. Yikes! It is impossible to show you facts on the bible and God. There is no reason for me explaining why we can’t show you facts on God, you probably already know them.

This is how I look at things. If you believe in God and live a good life, that is great. If you don’t believe in God and live a good life, that is great. Just as long as you a good person (not a menace to society), I’m happy for you. I’m not going to throw my beliefs on you. I’m happy to discuss them, as long as you keep an open mind about things and I will do the same. All insults are left at the door.

Yep, I agree with this comment.

Re: What religion are you?
 

Ummmmmmmmmm.., they discovered that that tombstone was really a fake.

Re: What religion are you?
 

I believe, but not in the same thing as antyone else. I don't think a higher power can be told about fully in one book.



I didn't mean that all religious people are weak. I believe they just waste their efforts trying to follow a specific doctrine.



I don't think so. I think me, the "non believers" have a harder time. You, and most people in the world, are confident that you're the ones going to heaven, no? I have to deal with people telling me how I am banished to hell for the rest of eternity because I don't believe what they do. It's really fun to have people tell you that you're going to hell because you neglect to do one thing that some murderers do. They're saved, I'm not. That's messed up. I'm not a bad person by any means. Some of the best people I know also do not believe in a God, they do acts for their common man out of pure compassion.



Catholicism must also be a theory because it has faults. I don't think the church accepted the fact (officially) that our solar system is heliocentric until the 1980's. The Church's beliefs are theoris as well. They have not been proven, and will not until the Judgement Day under Christian belief, so all religious beliefs must also be a theory since we cannot fully prove or disprove them.


People beleve blindly without facts. Even when the doctrine is untrue. If you believe the Bible is the word of God (making an enthemyme here), is the Torah not? People believe that. Therefore, then they believe something that is wrong, right? Fact helps back up a theory.



But Joeiss said that even if I were a good person, if I did not believe in Jesus, I would be banned from the gates of heaven. Is that right? Should I not get the same "holy destination" as people who were mass murderers and repented? I haven't hurt anyone. I don't deserve hell. If this is how it is, I'd rather be a good man and burn in the firey pits of hell that be an evil man who repents and has eternal life.

As for Bond...


Who is Jesus to decide MY fate? And don't say he's God or the Son Of God, because you have no proof.


But Joeiss said, and I quote:

Do I see an argument?

Re: What religion are you?
 

I only said that because you said the opposite. You believe it is symbolism, and I don't. I don't think either of us will hange our stance.

Re: What religion are you?
 

I'm with Joe here, I believe the bible is litteral. :) Well except of course the stories that Jesus tells, but he really tells them as examples so....

Re: What religion are you?
 

These arguments are pointless.

When we (agnostic/athiest) ask the religious people questions, they just end up quoting the Bible, or going back to something about the bible. Like a safety net or something. They cannot encompass a life without a higher power, because they have been brought up with it.

We cannot encompass a life with their God, because we have not grown up with it(for the most part)

Which brings me back to religion being Geographical.

Christianity is basically a North American and European thing.
Muslim is Middle Eastern.
Shintoism is mainly Asian.
Buddhist is Asian.


Do you notice something here?

Each continent basically has its own friggin religion. And dont even start with Africa being Christian, because its being forced on them, they have no choice at all.

Look at it this way, ( if your religious) take your beliefs right now. Think about them. Now think if you would think of those beliefs if you were born in Iraq with 2 Iraqi parents, who also have Iraqi parents. I dont think you would be all too Christian. You wouldnt read the bible. Or believe in your now form of God.

How many Middle Eastern born people are Christian?
How many North Amrican people (meaning white and black, not middle eastern or asian immigrants) are born Shintoist or Muslim?

I agree with everything Drop has said. Every single word...exept the part where he pissed off Joiess.

Faith is blind. There is no proof to a god existing. And dont say "the Bible is our proof" because No, it isnt. Prove to me that the bible wasnt written by people hopped up on shrooms or weed or hallucinagens. Prove it wasnt written by crazy people. Prove it wasnt the Idea of a king to get people to not start an uprisal. You cant.

And yes, what about the Torah? There truly cannot be 2 literal Holy Books. But wait...the Torah was written before the Bible, so it must be truer than the Bible.

Religion has become a fad. Thats all it is. To some of you it gives hope and meaning in your tiny insignificant miniscule lives that after your meaningless existance there is something more for you. But to others it is a fad. Look at California. Look how many people have been "converted" to Buddhist, and those other Asian religions. Does this mean that most of the upper rich class of California believs in it?

How many rock stars and singers and actors, directers, stage hands whatever firstly thank god when they win an award? Now...yuo cannot tell me that every single one of these people believs in god. No, they dont. Its good for face value.

I dont think Jesus, or God or whoever apparently decides if we go to heaven or not, would care if you belive in what they tell you to believe in. I believ as long as you follow the 10 commandments, your fine. And dont say "oh, so you are religious!" Because no, the 10 commandments are friggin common sense.

I believ if there is a god, he wouldnt care if we think hes real or not, as long as we are a good person. I mean, if he is real and we go to heaven, he would have all of eternity to rub it in our faces right?

But really, what kind of lord would care if you believe in him or not? It sounds like one of those attention starved toddlers that will piss you off unless you pay attention to them and constantly look at them. And if you dont pay attention to that toddler, he will "put you through hell" and destroy things in your house. Anything to get your attention.

And one last question, what religion were the people who said the world was going to end in the year 2000?


EDIT: Basically Religion is an organised cult. Thats all it is. And Holy wars, to me, are the funniest things ever. Its a fight to see whos imagionary friend is better.

But yes, I believe there is a higher power, but not God, in any form. Like Drop said, I dont think any book, or our minds can encompass him. We can barely encompass our own existance.

Re: What religion are you?
 

Ok put it this way: you build an appartment and you let people live in it. Those people really mess up, they make the place dirty, they fight with eachother.. even worse, they don't pay their rent and hate you for no good reasons.

Would you be interested in them? Would you let them go on? Or would you stop them and give those few 'good' renters a chance?

Dunno, it wasn't us.
But what if this high power WANTED us to (slightly) comprehend him? He could keep things simple for us, right? Being powerful doesn't mean no one can know anything about you....

Anyway, I'm getting tired of argueing, so I won't be posting much here. :p

Re: What religion are you?
 

Your analogy is slightly wrong.

Your saying we all live in the apartment god created, so we fight and whatnot, and hate him for no reason.

But you forgot to put that god also created the tennants of that apartment.

I could not hate my own creation. Its like saying you hate your child.

Re: What religion are you?
 

Re: What religion are you?
 

Well, that is dumb that he hates his kids. I don't think I could ever hate a child of mine.

Re: What religion are you?
 

Well if you have a son that denies that you exist, goes his own way, does malice to others, won't listen to you and kills your other kids, would you still love him?

Re: What religion are you?
 

Well, its hard to say something you can see doesnt exist.
I would encourage my kids to have their own piece of mind.

Analogies can only go so far. You cant bring God into a physical world analogy like this. Considering hes not physical.

But yes, i would love my kids no matter what they did. They are still my flesh and blood. My creation. I made them.

EDIT: Think of religion and heaven like a math problem.

There isnt only one method to get to the final solution.

Re: What religion are you?
 

We are not God's children. If we were, we would be perfect. We are children of Adam. None of us are sons and daughters of God.

I'm a strong believer in the placebo effect. Your mind could be anything if you wanted it to. There is so much negative influence all around. People tellling you what you are not. If you strongly believe in something, it will turn true. Use that to your advantage.

Re: What religion are you?
 

One can't make that claim UNLESS they have experienced BOTH the life of a sinner AND the truly righteous life of one that Jesus Christ have SAVED(a saved person sins no more, and that's ONLY the "tip of the iceberg")

"But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become SONS OF GOD, even to them that believe on his name:" -- John 1:12

All my life I wondered how can we possibly live perfectly as Christ lived perfectly, especially since we are born sinners into this sinful world and are constantanly influenced by its wickedness. I finally understand, recently, -- that is; by experience. The gospel is true. All along it was true!

I will tell all when I'm ready, and most will hear and still not believe, even them that "knew" me. But blessed is he who have "ears" ... who have ears to hear, let him hear...

Re: What religion are you?
 

question; how come u say "we agnost/atheist", i dont understand why ppl use both terms in one sentence, there are many differences, I am an agnost and do not like to be referred to in one line with atheist; atheist believe to, they believe in something _absolute_ ("there is no God..").

My question: whats ur motivation for suggesting there is something in common (or perhaps u didnt mean to suggest that..?)

(u seem to make a specification: religous ppl versus agnost and atheist. I'd see the atheist rather on the 'religious ppl síde (the same graduation of 'believe' and 'fanatics', yet about something the opposite), but either way, it is not this or that imho)

Re: What religion are you?
 

I don't think he was trying to group them into one singular catagory but rather use the two merely as an example in questioning those who blindly believe in their religion. I suppose you could make the case that an atheist could be classified as such too, but then you would be getting the inverse of how a Godhead believer (to not just call them "religious people" since you feel atheists are such, though in fact they are the antithesis of what the ture definition of a religious person is) would try to prove their point. If an agnostic isn't sure that God exists or not, wouldn't it be logical that he too would ask a Christian the same questions an atheist would? If perhaps to simply gain a better understanding as to why they believe in such?

Re: What religion are you?
 

I'm Catholic, suckas.

Re: What religion are you?
 

Agnostic now

Re: What religion are you?
 

I see Gamemaster is still the most unlikeable person on the internet...

Anyways, I completely agree with what Typhoid said regarding religions and where you come from. I mean just use your head, if you were born in, like, Saudi Arabia, you'd probably be muslim. It seems that for the most part, what your family or what all the people around you believe in, that's what you believe in. So if the North American catholics/christians for example here were born in Saudi or Lebanon or whatever and taught muslim or some other religious beleifs, would you be wrong?

And I do know not every single person believes what they were born into, but that takes up the majority... And in that same subject, look how many religions there are. What are the chances that YOURS is right? You could say the same thing about NOT being religious, but that's way different. Science learns new things every day. Nobody has solid proof of how we were all created YET, but who's to say they'll never find out? Like I said they keep finding out new things, so it's at least a possiblilty.

Add to that, everything in religion sounds like a blatant fairy-tale and you can't deny that. IMO, religion is just the oldest fairy tale the world knows.

Re: What religion are you?
 

Welcome back. :)

Still Jehovah's Witness. :D