[Professor S]

I was just going to leave this alone, but I can't let this stand the way Dyflon wants to portray it.

Originally Posted by Dylflon

What's the real story behind WMD? As far as I can tell, there weren't any.

If you actually bothered to go check out the thread that I posted IN THIS THREAD you would see that I explained the WMD situation pretty thoroughly. I don't feelthe need to do it again. Go back to my earlier post and check out the link and then respond.

And the UN scamming people and funding Saddam? That doesn't sound like the most credible thing i've ever heard.

Well I will repeat myself in this area, as I have done numerous times before:

The UN set up the Oil for Food program after the first Gulf War in a veiled attempt to continue to profit from such an oil rich country as Iraq while there were still sanctions. The premise was that Iraq would sell oil to countries in the UN, such as Russia, France and Germany (GO FIGURE!), in exchange for Food and Medicine. What was happening was that these UN countries were purchasing back these supplies at a greatly discounted rate for nearly a decade. Saddam would then take that money and purchase equipment from Germany (biological and chemical equipment) and Russia (military equipment, the Republican Guard used Russian tanks if you remember).

All of this was against UN regulations, and yet these same countries came out against the US invading because they felt it was wrong, even though Iraq was in flagrant violation of UN resolutions. Personally I think allowing Saddam to starve his own people and let them die of famine so he can spend top dollar for illegal equipment and build 25 palaces from 1994 to 2003 is wrong, bordering on disgusting.

I won't even mention the clandestine oil deals that had nothing to do with the Oil for Food program.

And this is all FACT, even though I'm not surprised you haven't head about it. Not many people heard about Saddam training the terrorists that bombed the world trade center either. Hell, that barely got out of the London Telegraph.

I do remember that American funded Iraq a long time ago to fight Iran whch Russia was backing. I also remember that America backed Saddam and wished for him to be in a position of power.

You also have to remember that at that time Russia was the US's greatest enemy and that Iran had a hostage fetish for Americans. You can't always look through history with today's eyes.

Also, the fact that Americans have killed many more Iraqis than Saddam over the last two decades sort of bothers me. I couldn't find the total estimate. Only the estimate of children. I think I remember 500,000.

PLEASE show me the resource for that little tidbit of information. I'm begging you, post a link.

I don't feel that trying to take one guy out of power calls for killing children and other civilians. You side step that when you argue and continue to talk about how just the war is and how ignorant I am.

Do I need to show you the posts that directly answered that charge? Its called WAR and innocents get caught in the middle sometimes. The US has done everything they can do to avoid civilian casualties, which I've already said in this thread.

People have been taken out of power without shooting up the entire place before. And sure, you probably still should be there until a new leader is put in power. But that still doesn't warrant shooting innocent people.

As I mentioned before, again in this thread, if we were going to remove Saddam we HAD to take contol of the government for the sake of the Iraqi people. Just removing Saddam would have led to choas and death. Even you would hav eto agree with that assumption. And in the end it would have probably led to a worse authoritarian government.

I agree that shooting innocents is wrong, but I also know that US troops aren't just walking around shooting Iraqi civilians. The video you posted is one fo the more horrible pieces of yellow journalism I've ever seen. The interview with the soldier is edited with the intent of making him look as evil as possible. In the end we have no idea what the situation surrounding that shooting really was. We don't know if he was a bomber, had a gun, or what have you. The enemy doesn't wear uniforms anymore.

You photos are equally out of context, but still very sad to see. But once again, this is a war and you have to keep your eye on the big picture.

But,hey, if America wants to become the iron fist all of a sudden and crack down on these evil men, there's a few other ruthless murderous dictators that America has put in power or backed that are also senslessly killing people. A prime example is the Saudi Arabian royal family (Bin Laden's family). They've killed far more people than Saddam.

I'd like to see documentation on that. I have a feeling your counting bodies without a sense of why the bodies are there.

But America doesn't go after them even though the terrorists who bombed the WTC were Saudi Arabian. Oh, I forgot. The Saudi Royal family is a business partner with the Bush family and have invested a lot of money in American economy.

They're also one of the two Arab nations that allow us to have a presence in the Middle East. Without them Kuwait would still be under Saddam's rule and who knows who else would have gone down next. Without Saudi Arabia the world might be a much more scary place right now.

There are many ruthless murderous leaders out there (some of which America put in power). I wonder why nobody is going after them.

One at a time, please. One at a time. Plus, the war is actually acting as a warning to many ruthless dictators, such as Khadafi (sp?) who ahs just agreed to UN inspections and promised to stop harboring terrorists (we'll see how that works out). The word is out.

As for the other arab nations that are considered despotic, the plan is for a democratic Iraq to help change the entire area. No one ing the Middle East has EVER known a true democracy. Once they see one operating with leaders chosen by the people, that may change. You just can't go around bopping everyone you don't like on the head. You have to have a long term plan, and by long term I mean years and not months.

By the way, you've quoted some pretty interesting numbers in your last post, please back them up.