okieday, let's see if this works.
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Originally Posted by Vampyr
He knew when he made us that he wasnt making a perfect creature. He knew the abortion was going to occure, but he didnt make you do it, and he didnt cause the pregnancy in the first place, he just KNEW it was going to happen.
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Knew when he made us? As in... he
made us? But, he didn't get the woman pregnant... and he didn't choose which sperm would win the little race and to which egg... he just
knew which one would and to which egg. But he only knew which one would after he
made the parents, 'cuz he only knew what would happen with the parent and its children-to-be after he made them to be that way. But we're only people after a little sperm, catch an egg; so he had to know which egg and sperm was needed so that he could make us (but not our parts of course). He didn't make the parts. Otherwise, denying those parts would be the same as denying the embryo.
He knew the abortion was going to occur, and he couldn't control it of course. But he made the person. And the person was made before the abortion, with God knowing there would be an abortion... because he [i]had to make the person, not just in case, but because he knew there was going to be a pregnancy. And an embryo is a life, rather than the parts of an embryo. So, after knowing the woman would abort, God made a human.
God knows, before you're born, what you're going to do. That includes who you're going to kill, and who you're going to make. My bad, God makes the person, you just choose when... and he knows. Therefore he knows who you're going to be with, but he doesn't choose it. But, since he made you, he had to make you the type of person that would do the things he knows you're gonna do. Therefore... if God knows someone is going to be evil, God is going to make someone evil. 'Cuz God makes us and knows us.[/quote]
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Originally Posted by Vampyr
And yes, of course the sperms potential is destroyed through abstinence, which is just one more point a human life isnt considered "human" until AFTER the egg and sperm combine. God isnt up there accusing me of murder every second I'm not fertalizing a girl.
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What draws the line? What defines human? A human is either the material that makes a human... the functioning mass, or it's the conscious thought, the final production. If it's a functioning mass, then an embryo is a human. But then, so would sperm and egg. But you said that can't be, that they have to combine first. Well, to tell you the truth... the embryo needs even more to have conscious thought. It needs nurishment to grow. It adds more stuff. But there's more to it, isn't there? An embryo has an immediate future of conscious thought. With
simple ingredients (eating, rather than sex), it can grow. A sperm and egg can do the same, they just need more complicated ingredients... eachother (oh yeah, and your will, which is needed for sex... and so is the girl's, otherwise it's rape. Of course, even then an embryo is formed. So it only needs one will to make a human). That's what it boils down to? Immediacy and Willpower?
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Originally Posted by Vampyr
Ok, cars are not that expensive. You can get them for dirt cheap at an auctioni. I think I saw one sell for like 200 dollars once. It wouldnt be the best vehicle ever, but hey, it has wheels and it moves. Anyone with a job can get a car. Maybe not a good one, but I never said that.
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You know what's also not expensive? Food. And maybe anyone with a job will be able to get a perfect child, too. Your argument at first was that Cloning would take money away from the poor. It's not the product that takes money from the poor, it's people who want happiness that don't pay for the poor.
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Originally Posted by Vampyr
Henry Ford was one of the first people to make a cool new product but also to pay his customers enough to buy it.
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So that everyone could have one and then it would sell better. In other words, he gave them a product they could afford, which was much more expensive than food. Food, which is more important to the needy than a car would be.
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Originally Posted by Vampyr
Also, I DONT think MAKING perfect human is good.
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Well, God makes people, right? Cloning is just a way of choosing how and when it is made. And God knows that a person will clone another. Cloning works in a similar way to normal reproduction. DNA grows and matter... and the person as a whole. Eventually, there's enough growth for more than just simple functions, but also conscious thought.
Maybe God wants a perfect human, but doesn't have the resources between any man and woman to make one. And since God can't make anything, except people... and he only does so through knowing when it'll happen, perhaps he knows people will clone a perfect person. Perhaps that was part of the plan, not which he made, but which he knew of. So, he made an intelligent person who'd have the knowledge to clone. And, he knew before he made the person, that the person would indeed clone. Otherwise, he would've made someone else, or there would have been a mis-carriage, 'cuz God has his own reasons, as you said.
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Originally Posted by Vampyr
And yes, there is harm in what you mentioned. If scientist are more worried about making these cool new genetic enhancement technologies, then thats what they will make, so that they can get more money, instead of focusing on making cures for diseases.
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If a scientist is the type of scientist that would like to cure diseases, then he would cure diseases. If a scientist is the type of scientist that wants money, he'll do something that'll get him money. If cloning came out, and it was worth a lot of money, the money scientists would do it. It cloning came out and it would cure diseases, the curing scientists would do it. Cloning won't change the balance of how many scientists are working to help people, and how many scientists want money. And if cloning does cure diseases, then it will be a good thing.
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Originally Posted by Vampyre
I wasnt asking for the rich people to donate money, I'm asking for scientist to create technology that helps everyone, both the rich and the poor.
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By saying the rich people would waste money on kids instead of poor people if cloning was made, you were trying to say scientists shouldn't make cloning so that... the rich would spend money on the poor... except, you don't want to convince the rich to donate. But, they'll never donate unless they're convinced. So, cloning's not the issue between the rich spending money on the poor or on fun stuff; and, unless you were saying the rich should donate, the argument was moot.
And scientists are rich... and to work on technology that helps the poor would cause them to lose money. So, they'd be directly donating their time, skill, and money for the poor. It'd be a great thing, but it's unrelated to cloning.
Unless... well hey, scientists either work to help people or to make money, right? And if they're gonna do it to make money, then they wouldn't be the type of person that would make technology to help the poor if it'd cost them, which it would... if it'd help the poor who can't pay much money. But, there's also the scientist that tries to make technology not for money, but for the poor. Those type of scientists would only be interested in cloning if they thought cloning could help the world. And if they tried hard enough (hard enough to actually make an effect), then they would most certainly make cloning helpful. And if that's the case, then their lack of efforts on other technologies would not be harmful, as they did indeed help the world. That's what you asked for, someting to help the world.
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I hope you give as much or more thought as your previous replies into your reply to this post.
By the way, God made me the way I am, and knew I would find this page one day, and that I'd post on this page, and that you'd reply (because he made you that way). Before you or I reveal any of God's secrets, maybe he'll step in with some divine intervention to stop it, 'cuz he has his reasons.