Socialism in Action

[Dylflon]

Socialism is a pretty sweet idea as long as you don't screw it up.

Strangler, you can have your capitalism. Whatever. I don't care.

I'm going to go over here and farm potatoes.

[Typhoid]

Hey now, I support the capitalism scum.


Its capitalism that made me wealthy.


The system hasnt screwed me over, therefore, Capitalism is my benefial friend.

You can farm your potatoes, yes. But just wait until I buy your land and services from you and then whore out your work like a hooker sucking a golfball through a garden hose.

[Professor S]

Originally Posted by Dylflon

Socialism is a pretty sweet idea as long as you don't screw it up.

Unfortunately its impossible not to screw it up, because its that flawed. In theory, wonderful, but thats because it doesn't take the fact that human beings will be running it.

[Dylflon]

Originally Posted by Professor S

Unfortunately its impossible not to screw it up, because its that flawed. In theory, wonderful, but thats because it doesn't take the fact that human beings will be running it.

Well maybe if we weren't all so corrupt.

But that won't ever happen.

[Bond]

Originally Posted by Dylflon

Well maybe if we weren't all so corrupt.

But that won't ever happen.

But the idea of humans not being corrupt is unrealistic. Which is why democracy works.

[Professor S]

Originally Posted by Dylflon

Well maybe if we weren't all so corrupt.

But that won't ever happen.

Its not about corruption, its about incentive, drive, self-worth and desire. Socialism becomes corrupt because it doesn't take any of these concepts into effect.

[Dylflon]

Originally Posted by Professor S

Its not about corruption, its about incentive, drive, self-worth and desire. Socialism becomes corrupt because it doesn't take any of these concepts into effect.

Socialism won't work because we think in terms of a capitalist model, you see.

Incentive, drive, self-worth, desire would exist in socialism as well. It's just in capitalist terms we see all these things as being tied in with income.

I'm not saying I'd really want full on socialism anyhow. I just thought it would be fun to bandy the idea about.

I do however like a lot of socialist ideas that can be applied to the capitalist model.

Free healthcare, anyone?

[Xantar]

I'm still waiting to hear why this thread is titled "socialism in action." From what the minorities in France are saying, the riots don't have anything to do with their country's universalized health care, its tax code, its distribution of property or any of that. They're angry because they think (and probably with good reason) that the white majority is racist. They point to the fact that even educated Muslims can't get a job in France because of all the snobbishness. A good quote I heard that sums it up: "If you're poor and your father doesn't speak perfect French, you have no chance."

It's deplorable, but I don't see where socialism fits in.

P.S. I'm no socialist myself. Being the son of refugees from a socialist country doesn't make me very inclined to be a fan of Marx. I'm just asking for a bit of clarification.

[Professor S]

I will admit to being a bit hyperbolic in my title, mainly to gain a little steam for the traffic (I am prone to do so, if you haven't figured that out ), but my feelings about socialism still fit in even if they shouldn't be the main focus of this particular thread. Also, France insn't a truly socialist nation, as you know, but they have adopted many socialist constructs.

In my observation socialism or socialist constructs cause people to be dependent on the government for their livelihood (in a general sense), whether it be a welfare system, healthcare and so on and so forth. As we we all know, you can't depend on the government to run anything right, so if you have to depend on it, it will fail you.

A lot of my feelings on the unemployement rates of France, Germany and others don't come from the article I posted, but of my belief that socialism breeds abuse by leaders and apathy by constituents. Most people want to work for a living, but there are also a good amount that will not do a damn thing if you don't make it necessary for them to do so.

A people become dependent on the government, the government fails them and the people get angry that they aren't being taken care of the way the government promised.

P.S. - I am actually a very big fan of Marx... as a social and political critic. The observations in his books were revolutionary (pun unintended but I'll still take it ) and very accurate. His solutions, though, were misguided to say the least and have been misinterpreted to the point that literally millions have died.